My journey back was more troublesome than the one out. Firstly I discovered that outside of Airports and the capital city the Dutch railways do not approve of credit. Attempts to pay for a ticket to Amsterdam with my mastercard were rejected by the machines and also by the ticket office. They would only accept cash or debit cards. I'm sure this is some sort of misplaced Lutheran/calvinistic morality but it was an inconvenience to say the least and I missed one train. Ok I could live with that but I had (and have) a lot of work to do so I paid the extra €10 to travel first class, a one and a half hour journey in first costing less than a thirty minute journey in second class in the UK. I settled down and started work. Then a gang of four skinheads arrived and occupied a section of first class with a ghetto blaster. That was bad enough but they also sang along with it which was really bad. Various Dutch passengers tried to reason with them and were subject to abuse. My use of English made me a target and it was all very tense.
The the train guard turned up. Good I thought, firstly I doubt they have got any ticket let alone one for first and now they will be dealt with. No way, the guard just walked through the carriage quickly and did not attempt to check any tickets. Net result an hour or more of noise and no work. Now i don;t blame the Guard for avoiding confrontation, however i confidentially expected the arrival of the police at the next station. If that had happened on Great Western the Guard would have phoned ahead and the train would have drawn into the platform and waiting for the police to get on before allowing exit. Not here. When I talked to Dutch friends, they said this is the norm. Now as readers will know I am an advocate of public transport. The Netherlands has got frequency and price right, but if its unsafe to travel then all the good is undone. I had a really good time with new friends and old, and a fascinating project on gardens (watch for details over the weekend as this will be an open project). So I don't want to whinge! The Netherlands is one of the civilised countries of Europe, a bastion of liberal thinking coupled with pragmatism, but this sort of thing can get of of hand all to quickly and its not difficult to prevent.
Comments (5)
It was not like that ten years ago when, living in the Netherlands, I was a constant customer of NS to go all over the country and beyond.
It's important in societies not to let liberal attitudes get in the way of having manners in public.
Posted by Bruce Stewart | May 15, 2009 1:13 AM
Posted on May 15, 2009 01:13
I don't like Europe (including the UK) or America for exactly these sorts of incidents on trains, in public parks, in shopping malls and so on. There is no 'rule of law' or 'civil society'. It isn't just skin-heads and other marginalized groups. People simple have no shame from these places. They will do what they want and are quite sure the consequences will be minor if any.
This just cannot happen in Hong Kong, Japan, Korea or even China (where it can get rather rough in 3rd class hard-seat on the way to Urumqi). You like anecdotes. Here is one about the Dutch that speaks volumes to their supposed civility. http://tr.im/loiz
Hong Kong
Posted by Bill Proudfit![[TypeKey Profile Page]](http://www.cognitive-edge.com/blogs/dave/nav-commenters.gif)
|
May 15, 2009 2:24 AM
Posted on May 15, 2009 02:24
Interesting post as my experience of living in Amsterdam was contrary in many respects – although I confess if was twenty years and more ago. I remember when I first moved there I was fascinated by the trust placed in consumers and how peer pressure seemed pretty effective at making the trust work. So it was the first time I had come across people weighing and pricing their own fruit and veg in the local supermarket. Back then, as now, you could buy a tram carnet ticket and were expected to validate it yourself, and on the whole people seemed to do just that. How civilised I thought. I remember one occasion when ticket inspectors got onto a tram I was travelling on, checking that people had tickets and had indeed validated them. They came across one guy who hadn’t and effectively said he was going to pay as he had no money. They promptly handcuffed the chap to a bar on the tram and left him to his shame, and when the tram returned to the appropriate stop on its circuit he was taken into custody. It was almost like putting the guy in the stocks but you rather got the feeling that most travellers felt that being subjected to that shame of your fellow citizens seeing you as a fraud and free loader was what helped encourage them to comply, rather than what happened when the forces of law and order got hold of you at the other end.
Without wanting to sound like an old curmudgeon, and not wishing to advocate the implementation of draconian police powers, I have to reflect that the difficulty with these type of self policing peer pressure led mechanisms is that they break down when the cult of individualism, “me first” ism, and lack of connection to any sense of belonging to a community and sense of responsibility towards your fellow members become the norm. Sadly, it seems to me, that is increasingly the case in the UK at least. I would be very sorry to hear that is becoming the case in the Netherlands.
Posted by Tim | May 15, 2009 10:18 AM
Posted on May 15, 2009 10:18
I blame 'Clockwork Orange' they should never have re-released it on DVD. You didn't mention whether the skinheads were male or female...
Ron
Posted by Ron Donaldson | May 15, 2009 10:49 AM
Posted on May 15, 2009 10:49
Hmmm...seems like this story might be within the scope of the previous request for artefacts related to justice...
Posted by WalterRSmith | May 15, 2009 9:36 PM
Posted on May 15, 2009 21:36