Verna Allee responded to my request for help with some interesting reflections on high abstraction languages. She specifically raised examples from Meg Wheatley and the Dillema Theory of Charles Hampden-Turner. My response covers issues on archetypes as a high abstraction language, work on the tractable aspects of an intractable issue (ABIDE: attractors, barriers, identity, diversity & environment) as well as summarising some of my concerns at therapy based approaches to organisational studies and the way in which people with systems-thinking approaches such as Wheatley and Hampden-Turner use the language of complexity to support an older paradigm: trying to put new wine into old wineskins (Matthew Chapter 9 verse 17 - well it is Sunday again)